tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3395481176873249475.post5494249377786449093..comments2024-03-28T15:17:25.159+08:00Comments on Classical Chinese Poems in English: 孟郊 Meng Jiao: 遊子吟 [*慈母手中線] Song of the Travelling Son [*Sewing thread in hand...]Andrew W.F. Wong 黃宏發http://www.blogger.com/profile/13042865467544530221noreply@blogger.comBlogger13125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3395481176873249475.post-39764543868407517482023-08-22T17:11:31.668+08:002023-08-22T17:11:31.668+08:00Hi great reading youur blogHi great reading youur blogA Midwest Collegiatehttps://amidwestcollegiate.blogspot.com/noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3395481176873249475.post-23857921281318062952021-06-27T01:55:14.694+08:002021-06-27T01:55:14.694+08:00Once again, comments from Ray are very enlightenin...Once again, comments from Ray are very enlightening! I hadn't known about the more cynical reading of this poem, so I've revised my translation<br /><br />Song of a Son Far from Home<br /><br />A mother's thread that sews<br />The traveler's warm clothes,<br />Stitched tight his leaving day,<br />In fear of years away.<br />The springtime sun gave more warm rays<br />Than any sprout's proud growth repays.<br />chinaphilhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14572591745611690731noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3395481176873249475.post-26962877947715639732021-05-04T16:13:42.372+08:002021-05-04T16:13:42.372+08:00Dear Jon, Thank you for your well-considered rath...Dear Jon, Thank you for your well-considered rather literal rendition. May I humbly suggest for your further consideration the following:<br />*Line 1: "doting" is rather negative while "loving" is positive;<br />*Lines 3 and 4: consider coining hyphenated words like "quick-quickly" for line 3, and "late- <br /> late" for line 4;<br />*Lines 5 and 6: please refer to my discussion with Mr. Ray Heaton in the Comments above.<br />Thank you, again. Best wishes, Andrew Wong.<br /><br /> Andrew W.F. Wong 黃宏發https://www.blogger.com/profile/13042865467544530221noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3395481176873249475.post-58568953210741491822021-05-01T18:45:09.477+08:002021-05-01T18:45:09.477+08:00A thread in the doting mother's hand,
Clothes ...A thread in the doting mother's hand,<br />Clothes on the body of the roving son.<br />On departing, she quickly and more quickly stitches,<br />But dreadful of a delayed and more delayed homecoming.<br /><br />Who says in the heart of an inch long blade of grass,<br />It can repay the sunshine of three springs?Jon Kwonghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05524592398290419666noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3395481176873249475.post-30097507942799340822021-05-01T16:49:02.695+08:002021-05-01T16:49:02.695+08:00A thread in the doting mother's hand,
Clothes ...A thread in the doting mother's hand,<br />Clothes on the body of the roving son.<br />On departing, she quickly, quickly stitches,<br />But dreadful of a belated, belated homecoming.<br /><br />Who says in the heart of an inch long blade of grass,<br />It can repay the sunshine of three springs?Jon Kwonghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05524592398290419666noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3395481176873249475.post-79261767048782225492019-10-13T15:23:23.412+08:002019-10-13T15:23:23.412+08:00wooo
wooo<br />Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02740439157077108583noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3395481176873249475.post-45784771478150420912019-09-24T03:48:31.099+08:002019-09-24T03:48:31.099+08:00Loving mother thread in hand
Journeysome son coat ...Loving mother thread in hand<br />Journeysome son coat a-darning<br />Fine so fine last stitches fly<br />Fretting long long returning<br />Pray tell, how this grassling's heart<br />E'er honor thy sunrich spring nurture?Jonathan Babcock 白 宗 杰noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3395481176873249475.post-47283047401133813022014-12-30T20:49:10.993+08:002014-12-30T20:49:10.993+08:00Thanks for the Chinese Literature, but I'll le...Thanks for the Chinese Literature, but I'll leave the comments for Chinese people to see how low The Great Native Speakers can go just to talk about a language they acquired in natural circumstances instead of studying.<a href="http://www.ccjk.com/language-translation/more-languages-translation-services/" rel="nofollow">English to Chinese translation service</a>Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04412203960505828400noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3395481176873249475.post-50224736780098811412014-12-13T09:11:37.087+08:002014-12-13T09:11:37.087+08:00I agree with Ray a hundred percent. I only said &...I agree with Ray a hundred percent. I only said "I can consider..." which I already did when I decided for a repetition of the word "son" at the expense of the true rhyme "one". Thank you, Ray.Andrew W.F. Wong 黃宏發https://www.blogger.com/profile/13042865467544530221noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3395481176873249475.post-10365358135450296572014-12-11T07:09:22.502+08:002014-12-11T07:09:22.502+08:00I don't agree that you should change line two!...I don't agree that you should change line two! "Clothes for the son to wear, her travelling son" says several thinks to me. <br /><br />It strikes me as a very personal line, the mother being so proud of her son. Using "the son" in the first part of the line followed by "her son" in the second part makes the line become the mother's thought, this is my son, the traveller. You can feel her glow at the thought, feel her love and feel her devotion.<br /><br />There's my view of the desperation of the mother; does she want him to go? I don't think she does, she fears the delayed reunion revealed in line four. She knows her son well, better than he knows himself, when will she see him again? <br /><br />Yet she sits quietly sewing his clothes, supporting him in such a simple way, enabling him to travel, again this shows her love for him, her travelling son.<br /><br />And this line becomes universal, every mother's son. All our children must leave to lead their own lives, to face their challenges and to make their own mistakes. Whatever they do, they will be loved unconditionally by their mother. They will be missed, often desperately so, but still they go.<br /><br />I think the line, as it is, is essential in delivering the message of the poem. The use of "son" in "travelling son" as important as the word "mere" in line five.Ray Heatonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11458153443445711776noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3395481176873249475.post-89126421108176078822014-12-11T01:43:43.889+08:002014-12-11T01:43:43.889+08:00I think your translation, Andrew, completely resol...I think your translation, Andrew, completely resolved my issue with cynicism. It is other translations that gave rise to this view, which I subsequently struggled with. There is no cynicism implied within your translation.<br /><br />I don't think my view regarding the mother's desperation counteracts or negates the motherly love which is also quite explicit within your translation. I think the expression of love is elevated by the desperation of the mother to want to see her son again, how much longing is expressed in her simple sewing, a love that the poet struggles to repay and waits too long.<br /><br />I agree entirely with you not translating 上衣 to be "jacket"; the parallelism being something missed by many other translators.<br /><br />The thing I appreciate most about your translations, Andrew, is your deconstruction of the poem, your desire to get to the true meaning of the poet's works; your influences obviously stem from the poem and knowledge of the poet not as in so many other cases from other translations.Ray Heatonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11458153443445711776noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3395481176873249475.post-82529098528723559192014-12-10T17:01:55.434+08:002014-12-10T17:01:55.434+08:00I heartily thank Ray Heaton for his most informati...I heartily thank Ray Heaton for his most informative and insightful comment to which I respond as follows:-<br /><br />Cynicism: Although I did, in my note, use the words "bland, though cynical yet true statement", I used them to dismiss translating lines 5 and 6 as "Who says...can ever repay" and even "Who dare say...can ever repay". That hint of cynicism which might have troubled Ray had never bothered me not because I had all along been submerged in the conventional interpretation, but because the poem is sub-titled by the poet himself as 迎母溧上作 "Written at Liyang on Mother's Arrival", 溧 being 溧陽 "Liyang" (on 溧水 "River Li") where he was a junior official. From this, we may infer he felt inadequate as a son, remorse for being so late to repay his mother, at most indignation at his own plight (not made plain in the poem) but certainly no cynicism on filial piety.<br /><br />Mother's Despair: If Ray reads despair on the part of the mother into the first 4 lines of my rendition,I must have failed to convey my true message which is, of course, the magnanimity of mother's love. The repetition of "son" in line 2 is not for reason of desperation. I penned it as such so as to bring "son" to the forefront to be nearer to "mother". I can consider revising the line to read "Clothes for the son to wear, the travelling one" which will result in a true rhyme with "sun" in line 6. There is no question of desperation either in my translating 身上衣 as 身上 and 衣 instead of 身 and 上衣. In this context, 上衣 "jacket" is clearly wrong as the poem is written in 3 perfectly parallel couplets with 身上 in line 2 in parallel with 手中 in line 1.<br /><br />Mere Grass Seedling: It has taken me a long time to come to this solution. I thank Ray for appreciation of my adding the word "mere" which, though not in the original, is the essence of the meaning of the original, the "lowliness of an inch of grass".<br /><br />My Heart: I thank Ray most heartily for suggesting that I should have penned "my heart" in the first person instead of "the heart" in the third person". I humbly agree and will effect the revision in the post.<br /><br />Thank you, Ray. <br /><br /> <br /><br /> Andrew W.F. Wong 黃宏發https://www.blogger.com/profile/13042865467544530221noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3395481176873249475.post-73175699382108030492014-12-10T00:11:54.039+08:002014-12-10T00:11:54.039+08:00A famous, oft translated poem, but one that I have...A famous, oft translated poem, but one that I have previously struggled with! I could never quite relate the final two lines, much because, as Andrew says regarding lines 5/6, that there's possibly a hint of cynicism.<br /><br />I understand the poem was written when Meng Jiao was in his 50s and so I posited to myself that Meng felt that he was an unfilial son and had failed to repay his mother's kindness, likening himself to a mere blade of grass in the face of the sun, inconsequential in the scheme of things, possibly reflecting his struggle to achieve success in the imperial examinations and achieve a respected career. After pressure from his mother, he made an attempt to change the life he was leading as a reclusive impoverished poet by passing the Jinshi, but even then only achieved a low ranking official position which he seems to have paid scant attention to, rather concentrating on his poetry.<br /><br />Meng's other poetry largely relates a scholar's indignation at his own plight and at social injustice, he uses rarely used words, obscure imagery inclined to the somber, dreary and lonely (see "A Concise History of Chinese Literature"), and so this particular poem seems a contradiction, it's almost too simple, certainly most interpretations and commentary about the poem emphasise the obvious message.<br /><br />So how does Andrew deal with this apparent contradiction?<br /><br />The poem has become one of two unequal parts. The first four lines read as despair, the loving mother desperately sewing to ensure her son has enough warm clothes for his journey, as she stitches on she fears never seeing her son again, at least not for some considerable time, a delayed reunion.<br /><br />The first line merely draws us in to the simple actions of the mother, line two very deftly shows her devotion to the son, the repetition of "son", in this line achieving exactly what Andrew suggests, elevating the motherly love for her departing son. Andrew doesn't read line two's 身上衣 as 身 and 上衣, (that is, not interpreting the meaning as jacket, leading to "The thread from a fond mother's hand Is now in the jacket of her absent son") rather it's 身上 and 衣 (on the body, clothes) which makes the line read much more desperate, the mother almost clinging to her son, the clothes on his back representing her wanting, her desire almost, to keep hold of him. Lines three and four so effectively heightening the mothers fears, on and on she sews as the time of her son's departure draws nearer, and then her greatest fear is revealed, a delayed reunion. As Andrew says, not merely when will they meet again, but when will this union of mother and son ever come to pass?<br /><br />My reading of the poem, implicitly supported by this translation, is that the last two lines are the poet looking back in time to his response to his mother's longing to see her son again.<br /><br />Is line five, with what to me is the rather strange expression 寸草心, the heart of a seedling (or commonly "an inch of grass, which is even stranger), an example of Meng's use of the obscure imagery? Whether or not, Andrew resolves this quite simply. Andrew's addition of "mere", a "mere grass seedling", intentionally or otherwise, is perfect in showing Meng's thoughts here; he is revealing his feeling of being inconsequential, despite his mothers unrelating love and devotion, his is like a stalk of grass before the sun. Leaving the line in the third person (in contrast to the short form of the poem, shown at the end of Andrew's comments) detracts slightly from this, and would be better I think as first person.<br /><br />Line 6, I think raises the question within the poet's mind; how can he ever repay his mother's kindness and become a good and filial son? Is he too weak to do so, has the reunion been delayed too long? The question isn't resolved, but leaves the reader questioning his or her own relationship with their mother.Ray Heatonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11458153443445711776noreply@blogger.com